-3

In a recent speech, President Obama said:

As a society, we choose to under-invest in decent schools. We allow poverty to fester so that entire neighborhoods offer no prospect for gainful employment. We refuse to fund drug treatment and mental health programs.

We flood communities with so many guns that it is easier for a teenager to buy a Glock than get his hands on a computer or even a book.

And then we tell the police, “You’re a social worker; you’re the parent; you’re the teacher; you’re the drug counselor.” We tell them to keep those neighborhoods in check at all costs and do so without causing any political blowback or inconvenience; don’t make a mistake that might disturb our own peace of mind. And then we feign surprise when periodically the tensions boil over.

(Emphasis added, full transcript with video)

BuzzFeed News, have seized upon the emphasized portion above:

Obama: It's easier for a teenager to get his hands on a Glock than a computer...or even a book!

Is it easier for a teenager to get a Glock (or a hand gun in general) than a computer or a book, presumably in the United States?

Andrew Grimm
  • 38,859
  • 36
  • 141
  • 342
  • 4
    Seems pretty ludicrous to me. A book is harder to get than a gun!? Computer, maybe. If I were to take the time to answer, I'd ignore the book claim and focus on the computer only. –  Jul 13 '16 at 10:45
  • 8
    Anyone can get his hands on a book or computer for free by walking to the nearest public library. And almost every kid is walking around with a tiny rectangular computer in his pocket all day. – Dan Bron Jul 13 '16 at 11:36
  • 1
    This doesn't seem like a sufficiently precise statement to be able to prove or falsify. How do you quantify "easy"? – Nate Eldredge Jul 13 '16 at 12:21
  • 5
    We could answer this literally, but I don't think that will be a useful interpretation of what Obama meant. Any attempt to answer according to what Obama actually meant will be subjective, and thus not good for this site. – called2voyage Jul 13 '16 at 12:22
  • 1
    FWIW, I think he meant buying a computer or a textbook through the usual channels. I'm not sure that is a fair comparison though, since getting a computer or textbook through nonstandard channels is also cheaper than buying a gun through standard channels. – called2voyage Jul 13 '16 at 12:24
  • 2
    Given the comment about flooding communities, it appears to mean "easier" in the sense of most opportunities not least obstacles, possibly a reference to the great [number of gun stores in the US (around 51,000)](http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2012/08/guns-in-america-a-statistical-look/) being more than double the [dwindling number of bookstores (a little over 20,000)](http://www.statista.com/statistics/249027/number-of-bookstores-in-the-us/). It's ambiguous though. There's enough controversy about this comment that it wouldn't be surprising if he comes back to clarify it. – user56reinstatemonica8 Jul 13 '16 at 13:11
  • @user568458 That is an angle I had not thought about, and it makes sense. I would still like to see some evidence for that. Is the number of bookstores really good evidence of the opportunity to access books? – called2voyage Jul 13 '16 at 13:17
  • Seems true in high-poverty/high-crime neighborhoods, but not elsewhere. – Mark Rogers Jul 13 '16 at 14:26
  • 'Easier' is not just about price. We have to take into account peer pressure and circumstances. If a kid is surrounded by people saying 'join our gang and we'll give you a gun', but asking about the library is met with "books will do you no good', then which is easier for them to do? – DJClayworth Jul 13 '16 at 14:32
  • 1
    @DJC That's the most subjective from among the interpretations here. Not constructive. –  Jul 13 '16 at 14:53
  • 2
    @fredsbend I agree that the interpretation is subjective, but I think DJ has a point. I really don't think the question as a whole is constructive unless Obama gives more clarity to what he intended to say. – called2voyage Jul 13 '16 at 17:14
  • @called2voyage I think if we assume he's not stupid, then a lot of these silly interpretations go away. A computer, probably means one the teen can own and use to better his life via education, work, etc and probably excludes smartphones. A book probably means educational as well, in the same way as the computer. But, being politics, there's many who won't readily admit that Obama is not a total idiot. –  Jul 13 '16 at 18:43
  • 1
    I think the discussion in the comments has demonstrated we can't agree on what the claim meant, so I have thrown my vote in with the 4 others to close as opinion-based. – Oddthinking Jul 14 '16 at 12:52
  • @Oddthinking Out of interest, how can mods cast non-binding votes? Do you have to be #5? (Seriously this isn't criticism, I'm barely a lurker on Skeptics, I'm honestly just interested in mechanics.) – Dan Bron Jul 16 '16 at 00:36
  • @Dan: We can't. – Oddthinking Jul 16 '16 at 01:37

1 Answers1

6

It depends on the age of the teenager, the type of gun, and the particular state or region within the USA.

If the teenager is 18 or 19 in many locations it is simply a matter of price. According to federal law, a hand gun can be legally purchased at age 18 and a long gun at any age. Some states further restrict gun sales, while others do not.

Dick's Sporting Goods for example sells several models of new rifles for under $200. Compare this to The new era of the $400 college textbook, which is part of the unsustainable higher education bubble.

Also, you only need to be 17 to join the military or national guard. Obviously if you join the military you will have some degree of access to guns, computers and books.

In some parts of the USA it is common for young children to use rifles or shotguns, but not handguns. See for example Rifle Deer Hunting Season Opening Day Closes School Doors:

At Bald Eagle Middle and Senior High School alone about 35 percent of the student body hunts, said district spokeswoman Rose Hoover

See also PA Game Commission sets 7 as minimum age for getting tags to hunt deer, turkeys

"We're not taking away the ability for the 2-year-old to shoot an antlered buck. If the parent decides, 'I think little Susie is ready to wail away' — go ahead. But they have to use their own tag."

Also, in some areas high schools have rifle teams. See High school rifle teams stay the course as national gun debate rages on.

DavePhD
  • 103,432
  • 24
  • 436
  • 464
  • 2
    This does nothing to compare with computers or books except the off hand comment: "Obviously if you join the military you will have some degree of access to guns, computers and books." – called2voyage Jul 13 '16 at 13:16
  • 3
    @called2voyage It's just a matter of price. You can get a gun for $200-$300. http://grabagun.com/ Less than a computer much more than a book. – DavePhD Jul 13 '16 at 13:21
  • 1
    @called2voyage even for around $100 you could get some kind of gun, but $200-$300 for something semi-decent. http://www.gunbroker.com/Revolvers/BI.aspx?BuyNowOnly=1&Sort=4&Tab=2 – DavePhD Jul 13 '16 at 13:26
  • 1
    Right, which would indeed make some guns cheaper than most computers or textbooks. The question is whether it is easier to find cheap, reliable guns than cheap, reliable computers and textbooks. – called2voyage Jul 13 '16 at 13:28
  • 2
    @called2voyage is there something as a reliable textbook? If you count the older ones, maybe, but the newer ones used in some schools are _depressing_ in how bad they are. – T. Sar Jul 13 '16 at 13:45
  • 2
    -1 - (1). the question wasn't whether it was "easy" but whether it was "easier than a book". (2) you summarily ignored gun control laws that make it almost impossible for even adults to buy a gun legally in many jurisdictions; (3) you summarily ignored public and school libraries. Matter of fact, based on #1, I'm really tempted to flag as NAA or VLQ. Sorry – user5341 Jul 13 '16 at 16:42
  • 3
    (4) $400 book is red herring, or cherry picking, or a host of other fallacies. He wasn't talking about rare specialized college textbooks. Or for that matter "textbooks" at all. Regular books can be easily had for free at the library, or for $1-$5 at used books bookstore or Amazon, or at $6-15 at bookstores. – user5341 Jul 13 '16 at 16:46
  • 2
    ... you also ignored the $150-$200 computers that are available. Which far surpass in power most of the best computers available only 20 years ago, even if they are junkey by modern standards. – user5341 Jul 13 '16 at 16:48
  • .... and for further nitpicking, free online courses exist; and are available on free-to-use computers at those same public libraries even for the super-rare person who doesn't have a smartphone or cheap computer these days. – user5341 Jul 13 '16 at 16:48
  • 1
    @user5341 These are all good points, and it all goes back to my main problem with the question. The original statement can be interpreted too many different ways for *any* answer to be constructive. – called2voyage Jul 13 '16 at 17:16
  • I gave a plus one for "unsustainable higher education bubble". The statement says as much about college textbooks as it does about guns (assuming he meant educational books). –  Jul 13 '16 at 17:29