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Are store bought apple fruits that are labeled Red Delicious really the public domain Red Delicious apples, or do they sometimes do something to them and patent a slightly different apple that they still call Red Delicious to consumers? I ask because I want to plant the seeds, if they're public domain in the USA; but otherwise it may be illegal.

I know for seed-selling, PVP seeds and such are supposed to be labeled with the correct name. The same does not appear to be true for produce, unfortunately.

Let me know if this isn't gardening-related enough, but it does impact a gardening decision. Feel free to refer me to a better place to post this.

Brōtsyorfuzthrāx
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I can't see why it would be illegal to plant the seeds of any apple, since they don't come true from seed. If you want to know whether Red Delicious are really Red Delicious because that's what you want to grow, planting the seeds from the apples still means you've no idea what will grow. Apple varieties and cultivars are propagated from live tissue, not by using the seeds.

Bamboo
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    http://www.freepatentsonline.com/PP00090.pdf ... I don't think the OG delicious is still protected in the US anyway... – Grady Player May 09 '15 at 15:55
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    of course what we call the red delicious now isn't the same as what we used to call delicious in the 1930's, because that apple tasted good – Grady Player May 09 '15 at 15:56
  • @GradyPlayer - cause? Your taste buds vanishing or do you think its a result of being chemically fed growing in depleted soils? – Bamboo May 09 '15 at 17:23
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    I think they have selected sports that have better shipping characteristics... according to the pretty cool wikipedia article on the red delicious, it used to be striped ... – Grady Player May 09 '15 at 17:27
  • @GradyPlayer I see, that's certainly a possibilty, but I do wonder if the fact that all the food we eat these days isn't anywhere near as nutritious and mineral/vitamin rich as it once was because of poor soil management contributes to lack of taste. My favourite apple is Cox's Orange Pippin, they still taste the same, or at least, I think they do. – Bamboo May 09 '15 at 18:40
  • @Bamboo, So, even a Red Delicious pollinated by another Red Delicious won't result in a Red Delicious? – Brōtsyorfuzthrāx May 10 '15 at 00:39
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    @GradyPlayer We used to have an apple tree that I was told was a Red Delicious, but it produces apples much different from other Red Delicious apple trees. I wonder if it was an older variety, or if it just wasn't a Red Delicious. – Brōtsyorfuzthrāx May 10 '15 at 00:42
  • @Bamboo It might be illegal to grow seeds from genetically engineered apples, at least, since that's about specific genes or traits rather than the breed. For instance, they have apples that don't turn brown inside when cut. Fortunately, these apples brown. So, I'm guessing they're not GE, but that's assuming they haven't done other modifications. I should just get seeds from my friend's tree this year, after the harvest. – Brōtsyorfuzthrāx May 10 '15 at 00:47
  • @shule I think bamboo is talking about patent/trademark protection for novel varietals ... Like it isn't legal to propogate most roses or apples by cutting, for example – Grady Player May 10 '15 at 04:38
  • @Shule - Red Delicious pollinated by another Red Delicious - no, you've no clue what you'll get from the resulting seeds. Vegetative propagation from plant material of the tree is the only way to guarantee what you'll get - and that might be illegal for some plants. – Bamboo May 10 '15 at 12:24
  • @Bamboo I guess what I was saying (to clarify) is that a plant doesn't have to breed true to be illegal in the USA. If it has a patented gene without license for you to grow it, it's still illegal. Most plants with patented genes are probably genetically engineered. So, you can cut the risk there a lot by using certified organic produce, which isn't supposed to be genetically engineered. Also an F1 hybrid wherein one of the parents is PVP is also potentially illegal for certain purposes (such as if you want to sell it; however, its offspring should be legal). – Brōtsyorfuzthrāx Dec 15 '15 at 06:21
  • @Shule - I still don't believe it. Growing from seed is absolutely not the same as vegetative propagation (from cuttings) which would be illegal for protected stock/varieties. And no, your Red Delicious seeds are unlikely to produce a Red Delicious tree... – Bamboo Dec 15 '15 at 10:59
  • Are you saying you don't believe that a gene can be patented or are you saying you don't believe a patented gene is still patented when it is passed on to its offspring (which are otherwise unlike the parent), or are you saying that you don't believe the gene can be passed to its offspring at all, or something else? Whether it is reliably passed doesn't matter. If there's even a chance it can be passed (whether or not it's expressed), then it's a legal risk to plant it. There are different plant protections for both seeds and cuttings, in the USA. Patents are different from those altogether. – Brōtsyorfuzthrāx Dec 15 '15 at 15:10
  • This isn't so much a question for a master gardener as it is for someone who has special knowledge about the varieties commercially sold (hence my doubt as to whether it was on topic). – Brōtsyorfuzthrāx Dec 15 '15 at 15:16
  • As an example, corn of any variety cross-pollinated with Monsanto's GMO corn, which has a patented gene, will produce seeds that are technically illegal to plant without Monsanto's permission (both the F1 and I believe all subsequent generations that have any of the patented genes, notwithstanding they are unlikely to breed 100% true). They have been taken to court over this (it is a real issue). If the Red Delicious apples they sell now have a similarly patented gene, it's also an issue. – Brōtsyorfuzthrāx Dec 15 '15 at 15:21
  • @Shule - yea, I think that's true, what you said in your final comment, but the question doesn't refer to GM apples, unless I'm missing something... – Bamboo Dec 15 '15 at 17:36
  • You're right that it doesn't specifically. However, it refers to public domain apples (which implies there are no intellectual property restrictions.) – Brōtsyorfuzthrāx Dec 15 '15 at 23:47