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So my parents got a knive set from St. Moritz, and wanted to give them to me. I'm an hobby cook, who just likes cooking simple stuff. I have barely any knowledge about knives or treating them, so here I am. I just had some questions about the knives, since I'm not sure if these are legit.

Here's a picture of the knife set:
picture of knife set

Whenever I google the knives, I only get shady sites and stories about people being scammed. Is this brand legit? The booklet that's included says the entire set is worth around 730 euros, but I can't find anything online.

And assuming the knives are legit, are there any tips on treating/using them? Can these be put in the dishwasher when cleaning, or should I refrain from that?

I have a magnetic bar on my wall to store knives, but is it bad to put 'good' knives on them?

They are kind of blunt at the moment, but I have barely any experience sharpening them, should I bring them to a special shop or something?

Thank you for your help! Just figuring out how to use these, if they're legit to begin with.

Erica
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AnonymousPerson
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    Like anything else, things are worth what people are will to pay for them. But the booklet claiming it's worth a given amount is ... suspicious. I know people who like Cutco knives ... I can't stand them. I've never seen a really sharp one -- I don't know if they just come dull, or they dull easily. (In one case, I was told they were brand new, and they were dull already) – Joe Sep 10 '17 at 13:03
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    I don't think magnetic bars are bad/do harm to knives, but I never liked the idea of having very sharp weaponry suspended in air by magnetism alone. – Willem van Rumpt Sep 10 '17 at 15:02
  • Welcome! It's usually best to ask separate questions separately, so people can focus on giving good answers to each. The magnetic rack one is probably already answered here: https://cooking.stackexchange.com/q/79264/1672 – Cascabel Sep 10 '17 at 15:11
  • Reasons not to put knives in the dishwasher: https://cooking.stackexchange.com/q/1804/1672 – Cascabel Sep 10 '17 at 15:13
  • @Jefromi sorry about that, just new to knives and this place in general :P – AnonymousPerson Sep 10 '17 at 19:34
  • Are these new? If they are and they're dull then tell your parents to take them back. – GdD Sep 11 '17 at 13:10
  • Legit new knives, even pricey ones, sometimes come dull or not sharpened perfectly, see what I wrote about that below... – rackandboneman Sep 11 '17 at 18:28
  • BTW: The low resolution photo hides a lot - do these blades continuously thin towards the edge bevel, or are they actually flat steel plates with just an edge bevel? – rackandboneman Sep 11 '17 at 18:30
  • @Joe there is a big difference between a) knives that actually have a significant manufacturing cost (partially or fully handmade, and/or using hard to work with but great steels including the higher abrasives cost), b) knives that are of type a) AND are tied to a single person or small team of persons as a maker AND that are under a demand that exceeds possible supply by that maker - this seems to be the case with Shigefusa and Takeda), driving a high markup ... c) knives that are made from inexpensive materials in an inexpensive, scalable process and sold at an obscene markup. – rackandboneman Sep 11 '17 at 18:37
  • @rackandboneman : I completely agree. And sometimes you get C, but they put the obscene price on it, then have a great 'sale' where it's still outrageously priced for what it is. And Cutco offers free lifetime sharpening (which is likely what the cost is to cover) ... so I wouldn't expect them to ship dull knives. – Joe Sep 11 '17 at 20:38
  • @rackandboneman I'll take a better picture after I get home. GdD: They did not buy them, we have recieved them from an aunt, who had them lying around for a couple of years. – AnonymousPerson Sep 12 '17 at 04:54
  • @WillemvanRumpt this magnetic bar is really strong, and has kept my old knives there for years of use. I still see what you mean though, thanks! – AnonymousPerson Sep 12 '17 at 04:58

2 Answers2

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"San Moritz" is the name of a line of culinary knives by the well recognized brand Messermeister. HOWEVER, the knives shown differ notably in design from that line and are likely a cheaply made product trying to capitalize on the name of that line.

Knives that are actually sold aboveboard (and perfectly worth the money) at ~$100 and higher apiece will usually be of a well recognized brand (eg Herder, Zwilling, K Sabatier, Chroma, Global...), or small-batch/handmade pieces bearing the name of the artisan or responsible workshop leader (eg Heimo Roselli, Jürgen Schanz, Sirou Kamou...).

Often (with a legit expensive knife), the steel type used will be clearly named (either by an industry standard name like VG10, 1.4116, 420B, AUS-8A .... or by a manufacturer-specific product name that describes a combination of steel and proprietary heat treatment method, eg Global "Cromova" ), and sometimes the hardness range will also be specified (eg 60-62HRC would be typical for VG10, 55-56HRC for 1.4116). A steel type and hardness do not signify the quality of the steel alone, since the way the steel is processed makes significant differences. A cheap knife is likely going to be of 420B at 55-56HRC, which CAN be a decent steel but often is not.

Out of the box sharpness is a highly brand dependent matter in all price ranges, for different reasons - a very cheap brand might not bother to sharpen well since it is costly (good abrasives are not that cheap), a high end maker assumes that the user is knowledgeable and will either know sharpening it or know a trusted local professional, and have their own idea of HOW they want it sharpened (there are tradeoffs to be made in sharpness vs durability, and different edges are best for different applications). BTW, for culinary knives, cutting behaviour is a combination of actual edge sharpness and blade geometry.

rackandboneman
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  • I see.. I think I can assume they're fakes though, since I've been looking at the knives and haven't seen any specification of the type of steel or hardness. I'll still take them to a sharpener, since I have no experience of doing it myself. Thanks! – AnonymousPerson Sep 10 '17 at 19:33
  • "Fakes" is a subjective term here ... but I seriously doubt these would be considered worth $800 a kit among serious users or collectors. – rackandboneman Sep 11 '17 at 04:28
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    BTW, be aware that there are ACTUAL counterfeits (designed to be mistaken for the original) of some popular knife brands (eg Global) in the wild. – rackandboneman Sep 11 '17 at 11:30
  • I've heard of San Moritz but St. Moritz sounds like a ripoff of a good brand. – GdD Sep 11 '17 at 13:09
  • The knives shown do not imitate the San Moritz line, though - so i'd be reluctant to call them a hard fake/counterfeit. Neither would I call that brand honest or expect good quality. BTW, just for orientation: $800 spent on a single knife would get you something from the second-highest tier regarding culinary knives (highest grade sanmai, honyaki or true handmade damascus from blacksmiths that you could consider the top 100 but not top 10). – rackandboneman Sep 11 '17 at 18:21
  • If one is just getting into into knife sharpening, the silver lining of having knives that are not as good as any "good knives" you may have is that you risk less when learning how to hand sharpen. – C.C. Sep 11 '17 at 20:29
  • @C.C. I've been looking into taking some cooking classes. Mostly been winging it so far. – AnonymousPerson Sep 12 '17 at 04:51
  • @rackandboneman I see what you mean, so basically these are decent knives which have the san moritz name on them (sortof), so they can up the price? – AnonymousPerson Sep 12 '17 at 04:56
  • @rackandboneman I also just found something about the type of steel of the knives, I think. The booklet that's provided states the following: _The knives are all made of stainless steel (X30Cr13)_ Does that say anything? – AnonymousPerson Sep 12 '17 at 05:03
  • @AnonymousPerson they are as decent as someone who got away with murder this time - so, NO. And X30Cr13 denotes a knife of very basic quality - at a great heat treat, makes an OK $25 knife, at a bad heat treat, makes garbage. – rackandboneman Sep 12 '17 at 05:25
  • @C.C. Cheap stainless like this is often more difficult to hand sharpen than better steels, and if the knife is expensive even if made of basic steel, the risk is the same :) – rackandboneman Sep 12 '17 at 05:27
  • @rackandboneman okay not very decent, gotcha ^^ – AnonymousPerson Sep 12 '17 at 17:31
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Over priced. Hot drop forged from a single steel. A better not great knife. Check the fork first. Can it lift ham with out bending? Forks are needed for lifting meat. The blades. All should know how to use a stone to sharpen. Takes practice but not hard to do. Start with a dull flat file about 6 inch's. Then your medium stone flat. Then your fine stone. Next you Onix stone to polish the blade. When you can dry shave the hairs off your arm perfect for use.

J Bergen
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